<div dir="ltr">Thanks for asking Ryan.<div><br></div><div>First of all, I feel that the ideas expressed here in this thread are a direct result of the failure on the current method to upgrade. I doubt I'm alone on this, but it's not like we have a night shift team. I work during the day planning the upgrade and attending project meetings, and then go right into working through the night performing the actual upgrade. If I could stage the new version during the day, and limit my night time work to 30 minutes, that would be wonderful.</div><div><br></div><div>Back to the Cisco active/inactive partition idea, which is the main focus of this reply, my first complaint is that this is a process which is only possible with one type of upgrade: the SU (formerly known as L2; yes it will be confusing when talking about Service Updates. I.e., SU3 Thanks Cisco.)</div><div><br></div><div><img src="cid:ii_158077042637c454" alt="Inline image 2" width="562" height="316"></div><div><img src="cid:ii_1580770d6598a355" alt="Inline image 3" width="562" height="317"><br><div><br></div><div>My second complaint is, for some products, and I haven't inventoried all of them, but I can at least speak for UCCX 10.6(1)SU1 to 10.6(1)SU2 (because dropped a call center mid-day just two days ago), you cannot even perform an SU, without it impacting production.</div><div><br></div><div><img src="cid:ii_1580774313f14b15" alt="Inline image 4" width="562" height="118"><br></div><div><br></div><div>With those two points alone, you might as well not even have this feature. It's inconsistent in its implementation, and saves you very little time. That's why people are thinking of creative ways around it.</div><div><br></div><div>But I will continue...</div><div><br></div><div>Did you know that it takes UCCX up to 90 minutes in some cases to actually switch versions, and then you have to wait another 30 minutes for all of the services to start (I'm looking at your Cisco Finesse Tomcat). If I have to flip two UCCX's over, that's 4 hours right there. I might as well do what everyone else is doing, and spare my late night activities.</div><div><br></div><div>I tried to find a source to cite for this next comment, but I was unable, and now I'm unwilling to look harder, but I'm pretty sure Cisco has a CYA out there which states that you must perform the SU in a maintenance window, do to the possibility that it will impact CPU/Disk/etc., and thus impact calls. I see the slides above show that you can perform the upgrade "while the system is functioning," but that's not what I recall reading in the docs. If I'm wrong in recalling that, then I'm sorry for making it up...but I think I'm recalling correctly. I just can't find the source atm.</div><div><br></div><div>Let's pretend I'm wrong though, and Cisco says you can actually perform the upgrade during production. Since the configuration and reporting data is tied to the partition, I have to be willing to lose all reporting data which happens between kicking off the upgrade and when I actual switch the version. Or in the case of users changing their SNR settings, CFA, etc, they might lose that too. It's not enough to just say "implement a change freeze."</div><div><br></div><div>Then, the fact that you can roll-back an upgrade to the previous release is a laughable joke, because the configuration data is sitting there getting stale, while the business moves forward. If you're going to roll back, it would have to be in the same maintenance window, else you stand to lose configuration and reporting data. Reporting data being the more critical of the two.</div><div><br></div><div>Cisco should have abstracted the configuration and reporting data from the application logic. I would be more forgiving if say upgrading from 7x to 10x, but for SU1 to SU2 is ridiculous.</div><div><br></div><div>You mentioned testing the new version first, and while I have seen some people want to test, say for example Finesse changes, these people could just use a LAB/NPS/dCloud for that purpose. I wouldn't say this is a major concern for me, but it might be for others.</div><div><br></div></div><div>I could rip apart the rest of the upgrade process too if you'd like (read me's, release notes, upgrade guides, cop files, defects), but I feel like I'm already hijacking this thread.</div><div><br></div><div>Again, thanks for asking. I appreciate you caring enough to ask.</div><div><br></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Oct 27, 2016 at 12:22 PM, Ryan Ratliff (rratliff) <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:rratliff@cisco.com" target="_blank">rratliff@cisco.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div style="word-wrap:break-word">
Honest question, what exactly is it about the current implementation that fails to deliver on this?
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Is it something in the design of the upgrade process?</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Is it that the upgrade takes too long to be done during any reasonable maintenance window?</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Is it that you have to test the new version before you roll it into production?</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Is it <your answer goes here>></div><span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888">
</font></span><div><span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888"><br>
<div>-Ryan </div></font></span><div><div class="h5">
<br>
<div>
<div>On Oct 27, 2016, at 12:02 PM, Anthony Holloway <<a href="mailto:avholloway+cisco-voip@gmail.com" target="_blank">avholloway+cisco-voip@gmail.<wbr>com</a>> wrote:</div>
<br class="m_-2597755701027086435Apple-interchange-newline">
<div>
<div dir="ltr">If only there was an upgrade process wherein you install the new version to an inactive partition, and then could switch to the new version when you're ready. /sarcasm
<div><br>
</div>
<div>But seriously though, everyone in this thread is essentially coming up with their own clever way of replicating the promise Cisco failed to deliver on, which is performing your upgrades during production on the inactive partition and then switching
versions in a maintenance window. If they would have only held themselves to a higher standard, we wouldn't need this complex of an alternate solution.</div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Oct 25, 2016 at 2:45 PM, Ryan Huff <span dir="ltr">
<<a href="mailto:ryanhuff@outlook.com" target="_blank">ryanhuff@outlook.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">
<div id="m_-2597755701027086435m_680939310062056763divtagdefaultwrapper" style="font-size:12pt;font-family:Calibri,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif">
<p>Matthew is correct, copying is listed as "Supported with Caveats" at: <a href="http://docwiki.cisco.com/wiki/Unified_Communications_VMware_Requirements" class="m_-2597755701027086435m_680939310062056763OWAAutoLink" target="_blank">http://docwiki.cisco.com/w<wbr>iki/Unified_Communications_VMw<wbr>are_Requirements</a>;
The caveat being found at <a href="http://docwiki.cisco.com/wiki/Unified_Communications_VMware_Requirements#Copy_Virtual_Machine" class="m_-2597755701027086435m_680939310062056763OWAAutoLink" target="_blank">http://docwiki.cisco.com/wi<wbr>ki/Unified_Communications_VMwa<wbr>re_Requirements#Copy_Virtual_<wbr>Machine</a></p>
<p><br>
</p>
<p>The VM needs to be powered down first and the resulting VM will have a different MAC address (unless it was originally manually specified); so you'll need to rehost the PLM if it is co-res to any VM that you copy.
<br>
</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<p>Where I have seen folks get into trouble with this is where a subscriber is copied, and the user mistakenly thinks that by changing the IP and hostname it becomes unique and can be added to the cluster as a new subscriber. I have also seen users
make a copy of a publisher and change the network details of the copy, thinking it makes a unique cluster and then wonders why things like ILS wont work between the two clusters (and it isn't just because the cluster IDs are the same).</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<p>Having said all of that, I would NEVER do this in production ... maybe that is just me being cautious or old school, but that is just me. Even without changing network details on the copy, I have seen this cause issues with Affinity. At the very
least, if you travel this path I would make sure that the copy runs on the same host and even in the same datastore.</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<p>=== An alternative path ===</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<p>Admittedly, this path is longer and there is a little more work involve but is the safer path, IMO and is what I would trust for a production scenario.
<br>
</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<p>1.) Create a private port group on the host. If the cluster is on multiple hosts, span the port group through a connecting network to the other hosts but DO NOT create an SVI anywhere in the the topology for that DOT1Q tag (remembering to add a
DOT1Q tag on any networking devices between the two hosts and allowing on any trunks between the two hosts).</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<p>2.) Upload Cisco's CSR1000V to the host. If you're not familiar with the product it is at the core and unlicensed, a virtual router with three interfaces by default. Out of the box, it is more than enough to replicate DNS/NTP on your private network
which is all you'll need. Assign the private port group to the network adapters and configure DNS and NTP (master 2) on this virtual router.</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<p>3.) Build out a replica of your production UC cluster on the private network.
<br>
</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<p>4.) Take a DRS of the production UC apps and then put your SFTP server on the private network and do a DRS restore to the private UC apps.</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<p>5.) Upgrade the private UC apps and switch your port group labels on the production/private UC apps during a maintenance window.</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<p>Thanks,</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<p>Ryan<br>
</p>
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<div id="m_-2597755701027086435m_680939310062056763divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><font style="font-size:11pt" face="Calibri, sans-serif"><b>From:</b> cisco-voip <<a href="mailto:cisco-voip-bounces@puck.nether.net" target="_blank">cisco-voip-bounces@puck.nethe<wbr>r.net</a>>
on behalf of Matthew Loraditch <<a href="mailto:MLoraditch@heliontechnologies.com" target="_blank">MLoraditch@heliontechnologies<wbr>.com</a>><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, October 25, 2016 3:01 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Tommy Schlotterer; Scott Voll; <a href="mailto:cisco-voip@puck.nether.net" target="_blank">
cisco-voip@puck.nether.net</a>
<div>
<div class="m_-2597755701027086435h5"><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [cisco-voip] Not supported I'm sure..... but what do you think?</div>
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<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">I can’t see any reason it wouldn’t be supported honestly. Offline Cloning is allowed for migration/backup purposes. I actually did the NAT thing to do my BE5k to 6K conversions.
Kept both systems online.</span></div>
<p style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
<div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">The only thing I can think to be thought of is ITLs, does an upgrade do anything that you’d have to reset phones to go back to the old servers if there are issues? I don’t
think so, but not certain.</span></div>
<p style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
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<div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif">
<span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Matthew G. Loraditch – CCNP-Voice, CCNA-R&S, CCDA<br>
Network Engineer<br>
Direct Voice: <a href="tel:443.541.1518" value="+14435411518" target="_blank">
443.541.1518</a></span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><br>
<br>
</span></div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif">
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<p style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
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<div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif">
<b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> cisco-voip [mailto:<a href="mailto:cisco-voip-bounces@puck.nether.net" target="_blank">cisco-voip-bounces@puc<wbr>k.nether.net</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Tommy Schlotterer<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, October 25, 2016 2:49 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Scott Voll <<a href="mailto:svoll.voip@gmail.com" target="_blank">svoll.voip@gmail.com</a>>;
<a href="mailto:cisco-voip@puck.nether.net" target="_blank">cisco-voip@puck.nether.net</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [cisco-voip] Not supported I'm sure..... but what do you think?</span></div>
</div>
</div>
<p style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">
</p>
<div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif">
<a name="m_-2597755701027086435_m_680939310062056763__MailEndCompose"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">I do a similar, but supported process. I take DRS backups and then restore on servers in a sandbox VLAN. Works well.
Make sure you check your phone firmware and upgrade to the current version before the cutover or all your phones will have to upgrade on cutover.</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"></span></div>
<p style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
<div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Also make sure you don’t change Hostname/Ip addresses in the sandbox as that will cause your ITL to regenerate and cause issues with phone configuration changes after cutover.</span></div>
<p style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
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<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Thanks</span></div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><br>
Tommy </span></div>
<p style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
<div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif">
<b><span style="font-size:7.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#6d6d6d">Tommy Schlotterer | Systems Engineer</span></b><span style="font-size:7.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#6d6d6d"><br>
<b>Presidio | </b></span><b><span style="font-size:7.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#0b4cb4"><a href="http://www.presidio.com/" style="color:rgb(5,99,193);text-decoration:underline" target="_blank">www.presidio.com</a></span></b><span style="font-size:7.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#0b4cb4"><br>
</span><b><span style="font-size:7.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#6d6d6d">20 N. Saint Clair, 3rd Floor, Toledo, OH 43604</span></b><span style="font-size:7.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#6d6d6d"><br>
<b>D: <a href="tel:419.214.1415" value="+14192141415" target="_blank">
419.214.1415</a> | C: <a href="tel:419.706.0259" value="+14197060259" target="_blank">
419.706.0259</a> | </b></span><b><span style="font-size:7.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#085296"><a href="mailto:tschlotterer@presidio.com" style="color:rgb(5,99,193);text-decoration:underline" target="_blank">tschlotterer@presidio.com</a></span></b><span style="font-size:7.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#3c61af"></span></div>
<p style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif">
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
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<b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> cisco-voip [<a href="mailto:cisco-voip-bounces@puck.nether.net" style="color:rgb(5,99,193);text-decoration:underline" target="_blank">mailto:cisco-voip-bounces@puc<wbr>k.nether.net</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Scott Voll<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, October 25, 2016 2:43 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:cisco-voip@puck.nether.net" style="color:rgb(5,99,193);text-decoration:underline" target="_blank">
cisco-voip@puck.nether.net</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [cisco-voip] Not supported I'm sure..... but what do you think?</span></div>
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</p>
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<div style="margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'Times New Roman',serif">
So my co-worker and I are thinking about upgrades. we are currently on 10.5 train and thinking about the 11.5 train.</div>
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What would be your thoughts about taking a clone of every VM. CM, UC, UCCx, CER, PLM, </div>
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placing it on another vlan with the same IP's. NAT it as it goes onto your network so it has access to NTP, DNS, AD, etc.</div>
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do your upgrade on the clones.</div>
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Then in VM ware shut down the originals,and change the Vlan (on the clones) back to the production vlan for your voice cluster.</div>
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it would be like a telco slash cut. 10 minute outage as you move from one version to the other.</div>
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Thoughts?</div>
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Scott</div>
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