<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class="">In the top 25 cellular market areas, nationwide cell phone providers are already required to provide Z-axis (elevation) data within 3 meters for 80% of calls [for compatible devices]. The requirements increase each year; by 2026, <i class="">all</i> cellular providers are required to provide z-axis precision for dispatchable location of +/- 3 meters everywhere in the US. <div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">This is all in addition to providing +/- 50 meter horizontal (x, y axis, also known as latitude and longitude) precision for 911 calls.<div class=""><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><a href="https://www.fcc.gov/public-safety-and-homeland-security/policy-and-licensing-division/911-services/general/location-accuracy-indoor-benchmarks" class="">https://www.fcc.gov/public-safety-and-homeland-security/policy-and-licensing-division/911-services/general/location-accuracy-indoor-benchmarks</a></div><div class=""><br class=""><div class=""><br class=""><div class="">
<meta charset="UTF-8" class=""><div dir="auto" style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><div dir="auto" style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><div dir="auto" style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><div dir="auto" style="text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><div><div dir="auto" style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><div dir="auto" style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><div dir="auto" style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><div dir="auto" style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><div dir="auto" style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><div dir="auto" style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><div dir="auto" style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><div dir="auto" style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><div dir="auto" class="" style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;"><div class="" style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;"><div class="" style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;"><div><div class="" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); letter-spacing: normal; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; text-decoration: none; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><font class=""><span class="" style="color: rgb(0, 68, 121); font-size: 9px; font-family: Helvetica;"><font face="Arial Black" class="" style="line-height: normal;"><b class="">Mark R Lindsey, SMTS</b></font></span><span class="" style="font-size: 9px; font-family: "Arial Black";"><span class="" style="font-size: 13px;"><font color="#794800" class=""> <span class="" style="font-size: 16px;">|</span> </font></span></span><span class="" style="color: rgb(0, 68, 121); font-size: 9px; font-family: "Arial Black";">+1-229-316-0013</span><font color="#794800" class=""><span class="" style="font-size: 9px; font-family: "Arial Black";"><span class="" style="font-size: 13px;"> </span></span><span class="" style="font-size: 9px; font-family: "Arial Black";"><span class="" style="font-size: 13px;"><span class="" style="font-size: 16px;">|</span></span></span><span class="" style="font-size: 9px; font-family: "Arial Black";"><span class="" style="font-size: 13px;"> </span></span></font><span class="" style="font-size: 9px; font-family: "Arial Black";"><font color="#004479" class=""><a href="mailto:mark@ecg.co" class="">mark@ecg.co</a></font><span class="" style="font-size: 13px;"><font color="#794800" class=""> </font></span></span><span class="" style="font-size: 9px; font-family: "Arial Black";"><span class="" style="font-size: 13px;"><span class="" style="font-size: 16px;"><font color="#794800" class="">|</font></span></span></span><font face="Arial Black" class=""><span class="" style="font-size: 9px;"><b class=""><font color="#794800" class=""> </font><font color="#004479" style="color: rgb(0, 68, 121);" class=""><a href="https://ecg.co/lindsey/" class="" style="color: rgb(0, 68, 121);">https://ecg.co/lindsey/</a></font></b></span></font></font></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"></div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"></div></div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"></div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"></div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"></div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
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<div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Sep 27, 2021, at 4:07 PM, Carlos Alvarez <<a href="mailto:caalvarez@gmail.com" class="">caalvarez@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><div dir="ltr" class="">They probably don't, and I don't think they are covered by the same law/requirements. Also, they have far more schills(COUGH) I mean lobbyists in congress.<div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">FLOOR could be determined by AP lists, probably. Maybe. Specific office seems impossible currently.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div></div><br class=""><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Mon, Sep 27, 2021 at 1:05 PM Alex Balashov via VoiceOps <<a href="mailto:voiceops@voiceops.org" class="">voiceops@voiceops.org</a>> wrote:<br class=""></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="auto" class="">And how do the cell phone operators know what floor you’re on?<br class=""><br class=""><div dir="ltr" class="">—<div class="">Sent from mobile, with due apologies for brevity and errors.</div></div><div dir="ltr" class=""><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class="">On Sep 27, 2021, at 3:49 PM, Carlos Alvarez <<a href="mailto:caalvarez@gmail.com" target="_blank" class="">caalvarez@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br class=""><br class=""></blockquote></div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div dir="ltr" class=""><div dir="ltr" class="">It used to be, then the whole Ray Baum thing, and now it's not. Short story: 911 call failed to identify the specific floor/office, person died. Now you have to provide enough info for a first responder to reach a person without help, which also means opening main doors if needed. There's simply no way that a laptop will give that specificity. Will it be sufficient to say that they are near the AP on the third floor southwest corner? The letter of the law seems to say "no."<div class=""><br class=""><div class=""><br class=""></div></div></div><br class=""><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Mon, Sep 27, 2021 at 12:40 PM Alex Balashov via VoiceOps <<a href="mailto:voiceops@voiceops.org" target="_blank" class="">voiceops@voiceops.org</a>> wrote:<br class=""></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">I wonder if doing GeoIP via a commercial database like MaxMind—and we all know how perfect a location mechanism that is—could be construed as a sufficient “best effort” in this case.<br class="">
<br class="">
> On Sep 27, 2021, at 3:28 PM, Carlos Alvarez <<a href="mailto:caalvarez@gmail.com" target="_blank" class="">caalvarez@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br class="">
> <br class="">
> Ours doesn't, but that's a good idea to share with the vendor. But in most cases, people are using the softphone on a laptop and there's no native phone app, nor a GPS, nor any other location info other than proximate wi-fi networks.<br class="">
> <br class="">
> I can see no feasible way to meet the letter of the law, and hate to be depending on the good graces of a bureaucrat to know that it's an impossible task.<br class="">
<br class="">
-- <br class="">
Alex Balashov | Principal | Evariste Systems LLC<br class="">
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