[c-nsp] Fake Cisco Equipment News Articles - very interesting

[Scott McGrath]

All,

Sorry if I was not clear I was speaking in a purely commercial sense As 
IP in Asia historically is not respected as there is a millenia old 
tradition
of sharing designs and producing identical products unlike the west 
where designs and production are proprietary to the original owner as 
orginally
exemplified by the medieval guilds and now by patent and IP laws.

As a example I recently bought a small chinese milling machine and there 
are at least 5 companies which make a identical product with
interchangeable components the primary difference being the color and 
the fitting of the spindle.   

The political dimension I agree is outside the scope of the c-nsp list 
and should not be discussed here


Scott McGrath wrote:
> I have some experience with the counterfeit stuff as well. 
>
> Purchased CWDM SFP's from a Cisco platinum partner - they failed the 
> validity check they looked good came in cisco packaging with all the 
> seals documentation etc.   It's just they were fake turns out 
> distributors use the 'spot' market to get product they don't have in 
> stock and is not available from Cisco at that moment in time and that's 
> how fake stuff enters the distribution channel.   Purchasing agents only 
> care about getting X units for Y dollars landed on the dock and the 
> receivers just have time for a cursory check 'Hey it has Cisco logos on 
> the box'.
>
> Also the counterfeiters are moving up the food chain there is now 
> counterfeit Catalyst 4500 stuff out there and that is much more of a 
> threat than a WIC or SFP as well as counterfeit 26xx and 36xx routers 
> which are used EVERYWHERE by everyone including the Fed's.
>
> But this is one of the risks which occur when you outsource your supply 
> chain and the chinese are not necessarily our friends they agreed to do 
> manufacturing in exchange for the production technology.    Just ask 
> Schwinn, Chrysler and Audi how well that worked out for them.   Cisco at 
> some point will be competing against it's own technology without the 
> 'Cisco Tax'   Recall the 26xx clones from Huawei they even ran the 
> current IOS!
>
>
>
> Ted Mittelstaedt wrote:
>   
>>   
>>     
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: cisco-nsp-bounces at puck.nether.net
>>> [mailto:cisco-nsp-bounces at puck.nether.net]On Behalf Of Skeeve Stevens
>>> Sent: Monday, May 12, 2008 9:30 AM
>>> To: isp-australia at isp-australia.com
>>> Cc: ausnog at ausnog.net; aussie-isp at taz.net.au; cisco-nsp at puck.nether.net;
>>> 2600-list at wiretapped.net
>>> Subject: [c-nsp] Fake Cisco Equipment News Articles - very interesting
>>>
>>>
>>> This is an article which should be VERY interesting to ALL ISP's and
>>> businesses using Cisco equipment.
>>>
>>>     
>>>       
>> After the initial reaction of laughing, I have this to say about it.
>>
>> It is clearly rediculous that Chinese crackers are going to steal
>> national security secrets by using counterfeit WIC-1DSU-T1 cards.
>> I think the majority of counterfeit gear they picked up was probably
>> along those lines.
>>
>> It is a bit more of a national security concern when the counterfeit
>> gear is firewalls.
>>
>> I also am somewhat neutral on the issue of the government buying
>> Cisco routers for $250 that normally sold for $2500, which was also
>> metioned in the article.  On one hand I don't like to see my tax dollars
>> enriching some Chinese criminals pocket, on the other hand I would
>> rather not have my taxes go up 90% to pay full price.
>>
>> I am mostly concerned with the following, however:
>>
>> 1) Purchase of networking equipment on credit cards rather than through
>> the authorized government purchasing system.
>>
>> 2) Counterfeit gear getting into the government offices through the
>> regular distributors.
>>
>> In case #1, that is clearly the case of network admins getting denied
>> approval for a project and saying "fuck you" and going ahead with it
>> anyway.  While I'm sure lots of people can relate stories of dumb
>> government decisions that required people to make end-runs around them,
>> (ie: the $500 hammer, $2000 toilet seat, etc.) the fact is that we
>> know about those stories precisely because the people in the government
>> who were forced to go through some overcharging scamming vendor,
>> complained to the press about it, rather than secretly slipping some
>> hammer purchases though on a personal expense report.  I don't want
>> my civil servants making an end run around some beaurucrat that has
>> his head up his ass, with a credit card and Ebay.  I want them going
>> to the press so the resultant citizen outrage gets the anally-inserted
>> beaurucrat fired, or promoted into a harmless little office where
>> he supervises staplers (which is how the government usually deal with
>> embarassingly incompetent civil servants) 
>>
>> In case #2, the middlemen/distributors/etc. that the government normally
>> is buying from are selling Chinese counterfeit stuff for full price.
>> Thus, they are buying the counterfeit gear for pennies and selling it
>> for millions, and making a killing doing so.  Well, the FBI discovered it,
>> where are the stories of such distributors getting arrested for fraud?
>>
>> All in all, a very disturbing article.  Not about the counterfeiting -
>> we all know it happens.  But the fact that the stuff got into the
>> government networks in the first place.
>>
>> Ted
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>>     
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