[iptv-users] Open Source x264 Encoder

Alex Moen alexm at ndtel.com
Sat Jan 23 10:50:04 EST 2010 

Actually, I have used the VSI product as well, and it performs as well  
as, if not better than, "professional" level encoders (we have used  
Optibase, S/A, and Tut in the past).  We are using them in PEG  
applications as well as in our headend (for an IPTV network serving  
residential customers), and I am really pleased in the performance and  
simplicity of their products.   They are simple to use, but they are  
not really missing anything that most installations would need for  
configuration parameters.  I was really, really skeptical at first,  
since I'm used to paying 6k+ for SD and 20k+ for HD, but I am happily  
impressed with VSI for encoding applications.  I would usually agree  
that "you get what you pay for", but in this case it's "open  
source" (kind of, since the VSI products are based on Linux) breaking  
into a heretofore proprietary market, and the price reflects that.   
BTW, the prices stated on the e-mail are off of their website, but you  
can usually pay substantially less than that through a distributor.

Alex


On Jan 22, 2010, at 11:26 PM, Frank Bulk wrote:

> Simon:
>
> Did you use it to encode local/cable channels for a production IP TV  
> network
> serving residential customers, or for a different scenario?
>
> It's been understanding that in this market, you get what you pay for.
>
> Frank
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: iptv-users-bounces at puck.nether.net
> [mailto:iptv-users-bounces at puck.nether.net] On Behalf Of Simon  
> Lockhart
> Sent: Friday, January 22, 2010 3:52 PM
> To: Bruce Buchanan
> Cc: iptv-users at puck.nether.net
> Subject: Re: [iptv-users] Open Source x264 Encoder
>
> I've used the VSI SD encoder, and while fairly basic in terms of
> configuration,
> the results are plenty good enough. The pricing is very attractive -  
> $7,795
> for an HD blade, or $2,650 for an SD blade.
>
> Simon
>
> On Fri Jan 22, 2010 at 01:38:10PM -0500, Bruce Buchanan wrote:
>> If I remember correctly, the price of the encoder for an HD channel  
>> is
> $8,000
>> or $9,000.
>>
>>
>> Bruce Buchanan
>> Senior Network Technician
>> Nexicom
>> 5 King St. E., Millbrook, ON, LOA 1GO
>> Phone: 705-932-4147
>> Cell: 705-750-7705
>> Web: http://www.nexicom.net
>> Nexicom - Connected. Naturally.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: iptv-users-bounces at puck.nether.net
> [mailto:iptv-users-bounces at puck.nether.net] On Behalf Of Jared Gordon
>> Sent: Friday, January 22, 2010 1:36 PM
>> To: frnkblk at iname.com; João Serra; iptv-users at puck.nether.net
>> Subject: Re: [iptv-users] Open Source x264 Encoder
>>
>> Just SD.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Frank Bulk - iName.com [mailto:frnkblk at iname.com]
>> Sent: Friday, January 22, 2010 11:55 AM
>> To: Jared Gordon; João Serra; iptv-users at puck.nether.net
>> Subject: RE: [iptv-users] Open Source x264 Encoder
>>
>> Jared:
>>
>> Are those MPEG-4 SD encoder costs, or HD, too?  Everything we've  
>> looked at
>> is $25 to $35K per channel.
>>
>> Frank
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: iptv-users-bounces at puck.nether.net
>> [mailto:iptv-users-bounces at puck.nether.net] On Behalf Of Jared Gordon
>> Sent: Friday, January 22, 2010 8:46 AM
>> To: João Serra; iptv-users at puck.nether.net
>> Subject: Re: [iptv-users] Open Source x264 Encoder
>>
>> As a small IPTV service provider, we simply don't have the time or
> expertise
>> to play around with an open source solution.  We want something  
>> turn-key,
>> and "hardware" or proprietary encoders fit the bill.  Actually the
> encoders
>> we use (Astria/Motorola/Vidtel blades) run a flavor of linux to  
>> operate
> the
>> hardware.  We get pretty darn good results doing SD content at  
>> 2.9Mb/sec
>> (constant bit rate) using Mpeg4 encoders.  I think your IPTV provider
> might
>> be cutting bandwidth corners trying to squeeze it down to 2Mb- it's  
>> just
> not
>> enough bandwidth from my experiences in a headend-to-set top box  
>> scenario.
>> I'm sure there is always another encoder out there that will do  
>> better
> job,
>> but when you factor in cost (including development and testing),  
>> time to
>> deploy, and stability, I think it would be a challenge to beat a  
>> dedicated
>> hardware encoder.  Our Mpeg4 encoder costs are about $5600/channel  
>> for new
>> encoding gear (not including distribution, or the chassis)- $3400/ 
>> channel
> if
>> you can find used encoders.
>> I'm open to suggestions however, as we're always looking for a way to
> reduce
>> costs and increase quality.  Now if you could put together something
> similar
>> to what you described, and sell it for less than $3400/channel- I'd  
>> be all
>> about that.  :)
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Jared Gordon
>>
>> Winnebago Coop Telecom Assn
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: iptv-users-bounces at puck.nether.net
>> [mailto:iptv-users-bounces at puck.nether.net] On Behalf Of João Serra
>> Sent: Thursday, January 21, 2010 8:35 PM
>> To: iptv-users at puck.nether.net
>> Subject: [iptv-users] Open Source x264 Encoder
>>
>> I noticed that almost all of you are working at some IPTV provider,
>> I'm just an IPTV application Developer and i don't deal with encoders
>> at all, so i have a question for all of you:
>>
>> Have you tried the open-source X264 H.264 encoder? According to the
>> things i read on the net, x264 can out perform every hardware encoder
>> on the market, even in real-time, both in quality and speed... In the
>> last version it can even encoder in real time without latency, making
>> it suitable for video-conferencing applications...
>> I suggest you to read this post in one of the x264 developers blog -
>> http://x264dev.multimedia.cx/?p=249&cpage=1#comment-2427 According to
>> him, there are no h264 encoders in the market(both software and
>> hardware) that can achieve that level of low-latency... (I know IPTV
>> doesn't care much about latency, I'm just trying to illustrate the
>> power of x264)
>>
>> My IPTV provider, for instance, uses 2 MB/s(in average, they use VBR)
>> h264 streams for SD content(they're using Harmonic's Divicom Electra
>> 8000) and it really looks awful when compared to a couple of x264
>> files i have encoded with x264 at 500kb/s(average - VBR encoded) Yes,
>> i know i can't compare off-line encoding with real-time encoding,  
>> so i
>> did another test: I encoded a video in real-time on a Core 2 Duo with
>> the same average bitrate of 2mb/s and again, my provider hardware
>> encoder looses again in quality... I tried Sports, Movies, News, etc
>> and looking to my Samsung LCD, o difference is very visible, x264
>> wins!
>>
>> So, my question to you is: why do you use those very very expensive
>> hardware encoders that produce mediocre results, if Software encoders
>> can easily outperform them? And they are much more cheaper(they are a
>> just standard servers, you can even add SDI/ASI PCI cards if you
>> want)...
>>
>> I know x264 can be a pain in the ass to configure, given the  
>> bazillion
>> features and options it supports, however, i think it's a fair
>> trade-off, if you consider it's price...
>> I only think i cannot test is it's stability, have any of you tested
>> it? For instance, letting a Red Hat Enterprise Linux box real time
>> encoding a stream for a couple of months without interruption?
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