[VoiceOps] "...but it works with Packet8"

Darren Schreiber d at d-man.org
Mon Aug 23 12:14:52 EDT 2010

Well regardless, thanks all for your input.

All your answers have pointed me in the direction we were already going anyway. I think we will continue to instruct people to turn off ALG and other nastyness "for best call quality" but we will also program our SBC software and our server to negotiate some test packets and auto-detect when packets are crippled, then adjust routing automatically.

Fun times.

- Darren

On Aug 23, 2010, at 9:11 AM, Scott Berkman wrote:

> I believe Alex was referring to the SIP stack on their proxies or "SBC"
> devices at the core, not the devices at the customer's site.  Trying to (or
> wanting to) write a custom firmware for a phone is a whole different
> ballgame.
> 	-Scott
> -----Original Message-----
> From: voiceops-bounces at voiceops.org [mailto:voiceops-bounces at voiceops.org]
> On Behalf Of Darren Schreiber
> Sent: Monday, August 23, 2010 12:05 PM
> To: Hiers, David
> Cc: VoiceOps at voiceops.org
> Subject: Re: [VoiceOps] "...but it works with Packet8"
> I had guessed that, too, until I discovered that Packet8's phones are
> accessible via the web GUI when their firmware on it. Guess what's different
> after you login? The logo.
> I suspect, at some point, the firmware might have been different but from
> what I can tell all the stock features are still built-in. Even the RCS
> server is shown and can be changed (on their firmware).
> I'm not sure they did much with the firmware, though I agree that the above
> is not conclusive evidence of anything.
> - Darren
> On Aug 23, 2010, at 8:09 AM, Hiers, David wrote:
>> Packet8 is clearly big enough to write their own SIP stack for both the
> client and core devices.  Don't know if they did, but I would not dismiss
> the possibility.
>> David Hiers
>> ADP Dealer Services
>> 2525 SW 1st Ave.
>> Suite 300W
>> Portland, OR 97201
>> o: 503-205-4467
>> f: 503-402-3277
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: voiceops-bounces at voiceops.org [mailto:voiceops-bounces at voiceops.org]
> On Behalf Of Darren Schreiber
>> Sent: Saturday, August 21, 2010 10:15 AM
>> To: VoiceOps at voiceops.org
>> Subject: [VoiceOps] "...but it works with Packet8"
>> Hi folks,
>> 	We provide a fully redundant VoIP service to our customers where
> they hook up two cheap Internet connections to our special little box and we
> load-balance / failover across them. We have been running into periodic
> issues with SIP ALG and such typical VoIP crippling technologies when
> hooking up our equipment, requiring us to get into the client's router and
> turn off SIP ALG (or Cisco "fix-up" features). Specifically we have issues
> with 2Wire devices, which are very very popular. We've been assuming this is
> standard/par-for-the-course behavior.
>> 	 We have a partner who is reselling our service and he has asked me
> a few times why our service requires any tweaks at all. He is literally
> replacing Packet8 phones with our service. We are utilizing the old Packet8
> phones so it is not a model and unlikely a firmware issue. Something we are
> doing in our way of configuring these phones is fundamentally different then
> Packet8. The reseller feels we should not have to mess with the clients
> router. I'm starting to think he has a valid point.
>> 	So, my question is, why does Packet8 work so well behind so many
> firewalls? I don't think their Aastra firmware is all that different then
> stock Aastra firmware. So my thoughts are:
>> - They might be using TCP signaling for SIP call setup instead of UDP?
>> - They might be ignoring the contents of SIP packets and rewrites and
> using rather "aggressive" settings on the switch side to figure out routing
> based solely on network headers (we use the actual SIP packets)
>> - They force rport?
>> 	I'm just guessing at this point, but the reseller has a valid point
> - we should be able to compete with this directly.
>> 	Let me know your thoughts or if you have any advice on
> best-practices for setting up Aastras (and other phones) to behave nicely
> across firewalls that have SIP ALG *enabled*. Sorry if this is a lame or too
> broad a question. Any tips & tricks you've used are helpful.
>> Thanks much,
>> Darren Schreiber
>> Co-Founder - VoIP, Inc. - (415) 886-7900
>> www.2600hz.org - Free VoIP Software
>> www.voipkb.com - FreeSWITCH Trainings
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