[VoiceOps] Number Portability Within a Carrier

Thu Oct 11 08:30:29 EDT 2012

I don't normally get involved in porting, but since I understand the NXX and
interconnection processes that sometimes helps me work through issues like
this. So while I don't have an answer I do have something you can try to
figure it out. Sometimes Tier 1 carriers will use LRNs to identify each
underlying company and when they have to port between the underlying
carriers they will do an intra-company port. So you could potentially tell
if one number was ported from one underlying carrier to another by checking
to see if the LRN has changed (granted they flag their carriers this way). 

When you enter your LRN in the LERG, you can add a note to the record and so
I would check the LRN record in the LERG to see if there is a note on the
LRN record. I would also check to see what the OCN is on the LRN record
because some underlying carriers will order their own NXXs and point
everything to the Tier 1 carrier's network because they lease trunks through
the Tier 1 carrier. You can find out what company the LRN is associated with
by looking up the OCN associated with the LRN record in the LERG 1 table. 

If the Tier 1 carrier doesn't separate out the traffic by LRN, then
unfortunately you really won't be able to tell when or who it's ported to. 

Mary Lou Carey
BackUP Telecom Consulting
marylou at backuptelecom.com 
Office: 615-791-9969 x 2001

-----Original Message-----
From: voiceops-bounces at voiceops.org [mailto:voiceops-bounces at voiceops.org]
On Behalf Of Matthew S. Crocker
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2012 5:50 AM
To: Paul Timmins
Cc: VoiceOps
Subject: Re: [VoiceOps] Number Portability Within a Carrier

In his example the tier 1 carrier is not changing.  There is no formal LNP
port being done.  The tier 2 is changing but both tier 2 carriers use the
same tier 1. 

The solution is to become tier 1 and handle your own LNP push and pulls

On Oct 11, 2012, at 1:08 AM, Paul Timmins <paul at timmins.net> wrote:

> Well, the easy (?) way is to make a test call, or open a ticket with your
tier 1.
> 
> But yes, I was stating directly that if your tier 1 doesn't provide you
notification of line loss, they're incompetent.
> 
> In order to take your numbers away, the tier 1 would have to be involved
(obviously) so if they don't notify you of a loss of customer, then that's
just ridiculous. Generally, you can't tell otherwise, as the only difference
between you and someone else is a route index in their switch, and a change
to their billing system to account for usage. If you don't have access to
one of those two items, you can't tell directly.
> 
> -Paul
> 
> 
> On Oct 11, 2012, at 0:46 , Peter Beckman <beckman at angryox.com> wrote:
> 
>> The problem is that I have no way of (a) knowing if they are competent
and
>> my provider is incompetent or (b) the tier 1 is incompetent. And if it is
>> the tier 1, are you saying I'm simply SOL? Regardless of who is and who
>> isn't, I'm hoping someone has figured out how to figure it out and to
share
>> their inside knowledge.
>> 
>> On Wed, 10 Oct 2012, Paul Timmins wrote:
>> 
>>> If your tier 1 is competent, they're passing CSR requests and providing
some sort of loss notification.
>>> 
>>> If they fail to provide same, well, then they're not competent.
>>> 
>>> On Oct 10, 2012, at 22:52 , Peter Beckman <beckman at angryox.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> So there are some pretty big Tier 1 names in the DID/telecom world:
Level3,
>>>> Verizon, Bandwidth.com. Many resellers resell the DIDs they get from
these
>>>> bigger companies.
>>>> 
>>>> The problem is that the Tier 1 company shows up as the "owner" of phone
>>>> numbers that we get from our Tier 2 or even Tier 3 providers. That's
all
>>>> fine and good, but the problem is this:
>>>> 
>>>>  Me ------> Tier 2 provider --> Tier 1 provider
>>>>                              /
>>>>  Not Me --> Tier 2 provider /
>>>> 
>>>> When someone submits a request to port a number, and they port it to a
>>>> different Tier 2 provider that gets its numbers from the same Tier 1
>>>> provider, I have no way, not even with an LNP dip, to find out that it
was
>>>> ported, that the owner had changed.
>>>> 
>>>> I'm pretty sure Tier 1 providers don't have an API or any way that I
might
>>>> be able to find out that they moved a number from one of their direct
>>>> customers to another. Am I wrong?
>>>> 
>>>> So how do we deal with this? How do we find out, in a definitive and
>>>> authoritative and programmatic manner, when a number we think is ours
is
>>>> ported away?
>>>> 
>>>> Beckman
>>>>
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> Peter Beckman                                                  Internet
Guy
>>>> beckman at angryox.com
http://www.angryox.com/
>>>>
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
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>>>> VoiceOps mailing list
>>>> VoiceOps at voiceops.org
>>>> https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/voiceops
>> 
>>
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Peter Beckman                                                  Internet
Guy
>> beckman at angryox.com
http://www.angryox.com/
>>
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> 
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