[VoiceOps] NTP Question

Tue Feb 18 08:33:33 EST 2020

That was kind of my point. You’re not going to use an operating system clock to drive TDM or things that need BITS. For billing and logs and things like that, what’s a few tins of milliseconds matter? And if the drift is in the hundreds of ms due to a VM server, I would say that is “unusual”.

—
Sent from mobile, with due apologies for brevity and errors.

> On Feb 18, 2020, at 8:23 AM, Mike Hammett <voiceops at ics-il.net> wrote:
> 
> 
> Non-TDM timing things. CDRs, logs, etc. I don't have an exhaustive list, but I can ask.
> 
> We'll have to just get a BITS service from Frontier for the TDM timing needs.
> 
> 
> 
> -----
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions
> http://www.ics-il.com
> 
> 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange
> http://www.midwest-ix.com
> 
> 
> 
> From: "Alex Balashov" <abalashov at evaristesys.com>
> To: voiceops at voiceops.org
> Sent: Tuesday, February 18, 2020 7:19:58 AM
> Subject: Re: [VoiceOps] NTP Question
> 
> I'm still going to maintain that VMs are fine in our considerable 
> experience, as long as the hypervisor environment isn't "out of the
> ordinary" and your applications of NTP aren't the kinds for which
> nothing less than the precision of a cesium clock will do. What does
> Metaswitch do with its system clock? Cut CDRs? 
> 
> -- Alex
> 
> On Tue, Feb 18, 2020 at 07:04:35AM -0600, Mike Hammett wrote:
> 
> > I would love to have my own stratum one in each Frontier CO we're in. Unfortunately, we don't have access to put GPS antennas on the buildings and the important buildings don't have windows and have us behind multiple layers of brick walls\concrete floors, so an indoor antenna isn't likely to work. 
> > 
> > 
> > Clocks that accept their information via PTP from a location where we can put up a GPS antenna run into the thousands of dollars (though I am still waiting on quotes), thus aren't exactly reasonably priced. 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > To seemingly conclude the thread, 3 are required, 4 or 5 are recommended. VM NTP servers are to be avoided. 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > I'll roll with VMs for now while I develop a plan to have something there I can use the hardware directly (no VM). I'll swap out each VM for hardware when a reasonable course of action is available. 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ----- 
> > Mike Hammett 
> > Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> > http://www.ics-il.com 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Midwest Internet Exchange 
> > http://www.midwest-ix.com 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > 
> > From: "Peter Beckman" <beckman at angryox.com> 
> > To: "Tim Bray" <tim at kooky.org> 
> > Cc: voiceops at voiceops.org 
> > Sent: Monday, February 17, 2020 10:02:46 PM 
> > Subject: Re: [VoiceOps] NTP Question 
> > 
> > Ooooh I like that one! 
> > 
> > The thread got a little confusing -- 
> > 
> > Are we talking about using NTP as a client on VMs? 
> > 
> > Or using VMs to run NTP servers? 
> > 
> > If as a server: 
> > Hell NAH! Don't do it. Like everyone said, the clock available to the 
> > OS isn't reliable, you don't want its drift to affect other machine's 
> > clocks. 
> > 
> > If as a client: 
> > Hell YAH! VM clocks are unreliable. Heck, we had a dedicated server that 
> > had a 14 second a day drift! We used the heck out of NTP to keep that 
> > sucker from losing time. 
> > 
> > Sort of related: I really love OVH as a hosting provider, but they offer 
> > one time source, and it is in Beauharnois, Canada, even if you use their 
> > Oregon US Datacenter. These NTP devices are so inexpensive to cover a whole 
> > datacenter, why are we introducing network latency?!? 
> > 
> > I am of the opinion that each physical datacenter should provide its own 
> > Stratum 1 NTP source. 
> > 
> > Beckman 
> > 
> > On Tue, 18 Feb 2020, Tim Bray via VoiceOps wrote: 
> > 
> > > On 17/02/2020 21:52, Mike Hammett wrote: 
> > >> How many NTP servers do you guys run?
> > >> I just spun up two NTP servers in different locations on this network. 
> > >> Metaswitch just asked me for at least four (preferably five, or even more). 
> > >> Right now, the ones I have are just referencing the US pool. Eventually, 
> > >> they'll reference on-net GPS-backed devices. 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > https://store.uputronics.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=60_70&product_id=92 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > LeoNTP server. If you want to run your own. 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > -- 
> > > Tim Bray 
> > > Huddersfield, GB 
> > > tim at kooky.org 
> > > +44 7966479015 
> > > 
> > > 
> > 
> > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
> > Peter Beckman Internet Guy 
> > beckman at angryox.com http://www.angryox.com/ 
> > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
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> 
> -- 
> Alex Balashov | Principal | Evariste Systems LLC
> 
> Tel: +1-706-510-6800 / +1-800-250-5920 (toll-free) 
> Web: http://www.evaristesys.com/, http://www.csrpswitch.com/
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