[cisco-voip] Torn apart by choices - old or newsolutions?Simply speaking: CM5.0 or CM4.x

Thu Apr 13 13:39:13 EDT 2006

Our Cisco Vendor is stating that CCM 4.0 train will change to the 6.0
(win) train in the future.  Anyone heard this?

________________________________

From: cisco-voip-bounces at puck.nether.net
[mailto:cisco-voip-bounces at puck.nether.net] On Behalf Of Voll, Scott
Sent: Thursday, April 13, 2006 10:47 AM
To: Lelio Fulgenzi; candace_holman at harvard.edu;
cisco-voip at puck.nether.net
Subject: Re: [cisco-voip] Torn apart by choices - old or
newsolutions?Simply speaking: CM5.0 or CM4.x

Once again to echo:

4.1 ---- features ------ 5.0

4.2 -----features ----- 5.1

I think I heard 5.1 is slated for end of this year, (But it's Cisco, so
probably beginning of 2007)

I will be waiting for 5.2 personally, but am really looking forward to
the patching / upgrade process of the 5.x train with active and standby
partitions.

Scott

PS.  The last "dot oh" upgrade I did, took 23 hours, 3 tac engineers and
6-7 developers.

________________________________

From: cisco-voip-bounces at puck.nether.net
[mailto:cisco-voip-bounces at puck.nether.net] On Behalf Of Lelio Fulgenzi
Sent: Thursday, April 13, 2006 9:19 AM
To: candace_holman at harvard.edu; cisco-voip at puck.nether.net
Subject: Re: [cisco-voip] Torn apart by choices - old or new
solutions?Simply speaking: CM5.0 or CM4.x

Agreed on those points. Sticking with 4.1(3) should provide an easier
feature upgrade to 5.0. But from what I hear, the 4.2 features will be
available in 5.1 and that was slated for release in 2007 or something
like that. But you are right....I would use several years as a guide
line. 2 to 3 years.

It comes down to:

*	feature availability (SIP, etc) 
*	upgrade issues (current features not supported in future version
target) 
*	bleeding edge factor -or- the "dot oh" syndrome 
*	support issues (how much experience does the TAC have) 
*	stability (are there all the patches you want in there) 

and I would also add, product availability. It's probably alot easier to
get 4.1(3) install media than it would be 4.2 or 5.0.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------
Lelio Fulgenzi, B.A.
Network Analyst (CCS) * University of Guelph * Guelph, Ontario N1G 2W1
(519) 824-4120 x56354 (519) 767-1060 FAX (JNHN)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ 
Sanity First : Number of days with fewer than
50 messages in my inbox at the end of the day:   buffer overrun

	----- Original Message ----- 

	From: Candace Holman <mailto:candace_holman at harvard.edu>  

	To: cisco-voip at puck.nether.net 

	Sent: Thursday, April 13, 2006 12:11 PM

	Subject: Re: [cisco-voip] Torn apart by choices - old or new
solutions? Simply speaking: CM5.0 or CM4.x

	To some extent I agree with Lelio and Scott, but it may be worth
it to 
	you to consider some other points:

	    * 4.x will not have SIP lines for several years at best
	    * 5.x has the option for SIP and SCCP
	    * it could be difficult to upgrade 4.2 -> 5.x because some
of the
	      user features in 4.2 are not duplicated in 5.x for several
years
	      at best
	    * 5.x is a RH Linux train, 4.2 is windows so your
considerations for
	      hardware, organizational policies or tech philosophies,
	      engineering skillset, etc _may_ be different

	Candace

	> Subject:
	> [cisco-voip] Torn apart by choices - old or new solutions?
Simply 
	> speaking: CM5.0 or CM4.x
	> From:
	> Netfortius <netfortius at gmail.com>
	> Date:
	> Thu, 13 Apr 2006 10:33:58 -0500
	>
	> To:
	> cisco-voip at puck.nether.net
	>
	>
	> You may have already gotten used to my last string of
questions here, which - 
	> I am not hiding it - are part of my attempt to gain info from
the more 
	> experienced people, on this subject, regarding a project I am
working on for 
	> deployment of multi-site IPT & VoIP. I have gone into some
details, for some 
	> questions I had, but now - reading tons of material every day,
I have become 
	> very worried about the full blown solution chosen, vs. what is
being promised 
	> just "around the corner". Here is where I would appreciate any
comments, of 
	> any nature, thoughts, experience, "what-if" - anything you can
share about 
	> this subject:
	>
	> Scenario: multi-site deployment of Cisco CM, with the
following objectives in 
	> mind:
	>
	> 1. Replacement of existing old telephony solution,
Nortel-based, consisting of 
	> PBX in each location, with Cisco-based IP-based communication
systems (and 
	> not only one-to-one replacement of phones, but also steps
toward unified 
	> communications)
	>
	> 2. Installation of Cisco solution consisting of:
	> a. CM 4.x (advised by Cisco) at the HQ + Unity integrated with
Exchange 2003 
	> and a handful of IP phones (major testers of the technology)
and integration 
	> with existing Nortel PBX at the HQ (PHASE 1)
	> b. IP phones in the remote location (complete replacement of
everything old, 
	> including PBX) + SRST + standalone (storage-wise) Unity (PHASE
1)
	> c. Unified messaging at the HQ, in the "pilot" group, to the
best of the 
	> abilities and availability of products around CM 4.x (e.g. PA,
among others, 
	> as an example of what I am getting at) (PHASE 1)
	> d. Experience from c> ==> full implementation of unified
messaging at the 
	> first remote ("upgrade" of the standalone Unity into an
Exchange-tied one - 
	> is this even possible?!?) (PHASE 2)
	> e. remote site used as template fro all other sites (PHASE 2)
	> f. full upgrade at the HQ (PHASE 2), with the exception of
Call Center
	> g. Cisco IPCC replacement of the existing Nortel Call Center,
after the 
	> entire VoIP and IPT has proven reliable to sustain a Customer
Service (PHASE 
	> 3)
	>
	> 3. The unified communications (including messaging) will
eventually adddress 
	> various business needs, primarily focused on mobility and
real-time 
	> communications and sharing
	>
	> Having said all of the above, here are the issues I am
struggling with:
	>
	> - I have (and nobody in my network geeks group) no real
experience with Cisco 
	> VoIP/IPT;
	> - the suggested solution, from Cisco, revolves around a CM 4.2
and, gradually, 
	> as explained above, updates to the point of full unified
messaging - still 
	> 4.2-based
	> - I am getting conflicting messages from our Cisco group -
they advise us to 
	> do the install with CM 4.2 (which would end up as a cluster of
multiple 
	> servers, at the HQ), not CM 5.0, but:
	> - I am reading and reading, and it appears to me that some
features associated 
	> with CM 4.2 are dying (e.g. PA), while CM 5.0 seems to open
the door for much 
	> more, but not everything backward compatible with 4.x
	> - tons of features are being advertised as related to CM 5.0,
only, but are 
	> not ready yet, and are to be released this year (majority in
second quarter)
	>
	> Bottom line - I am struggling with one major question (with no
easy answer - 
	> thus appreciating any comments this list may have): should I
move ahead as 
	> started, with the one site + pilot HQ, on CM 4.2 (PHASE 1),
then go over all 
	> phases, then analyze what would need to be upgraded to a 5.0
environment, if 
	> certain additional features would become available and needed,
and not 
	> backward compatible
	> OR
	> should I just put a stop to the CM 4.x analysis and planning,
and redo 
	> everything (with the delay caused by various products
availability) around CM 
	> 5.0?
	>
	> As I said - any $0.02-$64K comments will be really
appreciated. I will try to 
	> consolidate this type of info, in something useful, if enough
data warrants 
	> it.
	>
	> Thanks,
	> Stefan
	>
	>   

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