[Outages-discussion] [External] Re: [outages] PINCH Re: Slack Outage?

[Neil Hanlon]

Honestly I think it might be time this list evolve outside a listserv. I've seen a lot of groups moving to stuff like discourse (no, not discord: https://www.discourse.org) , which allows for everyone to subscribe to exactly what they want etc.

It's probably not a perfect drop in replacement, but might be a good idea for lists moving forward? 

On May 21, 2018, 19:05, at 19:05, Scott Whyte <swhyte at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>On 5/21/18 2:43 PM, Jay R. Ashworth wrote:
>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Scott Whyte" <swhyte at gmail.com>
>>>>>> Slack is only barely on-topic for the list anyway.
>>>>> Explain that a bit more please?  From the about page
>>>>> "outages-reporting that would apply to failures of major
>communications
>>>>> infrastructure components having significant traffic-carrying
>capacity,"
>>>> Slack being an end-user service, it's on-topicness falls under
>"eyeball services
>>>> that our audience is likely to get lots of reports about" -- with a
>couple
>>>> extra points because lots of the people on the list probably use it
>themselves.
>>> Ok so you are differentiating between transit and end traffic,
>despite
>>> the fact that several "eyeball" networks source/sink way more
>packets
>>> than any ISP nowadays.  I can see the value of this differentiation
>(if
>>> I squint), maybe we need a eyeball-outages to better separate the
>two?
>>> Or is there one I'm not aware of?  I'm tired of hearing about single
>>> circuit outages, but I'm super tired of all the whinging.
>> Not eyeball network -- eyeball *services*.
>>
>> A transport outage inside Spectrum is clearly on-topic.
>>
>> A transport outage at 111 8th St is also on-topic, even though it's
>in a
>> single building.
>>
>> An infrastructure outage at Amazon East is on topic.
>>
>> An outage of a single service hosted by Amazon (or whomever) depends
>a lot
>> on what that service is -- how many trouble calls is it likely to
>generate,
>> and how important to the maintanence of the network that service is.
>>
>> Flickr, for example, wins on the first point; Slack on the second.
>>
>> That's the way I've been looking at -- and handling -- it, to date.
>>
>> Does that seem reasonable?
>Man after an hour of kicking this around I feel your pain.  We'd like
>to 
>discern between underlay, overlay, and service, but wtf do those terms 
>even mean in the modern network where any layer can and is transported 
>over another layer?
>
>For me, pulling what are "clearly" services :) off into another list 
>might be the most helpful and least disruptive.  In this case I'd 
>suggest anything that is a service would be fair game on the new list, 
>to lighten the moderation load, similar to how on this list anything 
>"clearly" underlay is fair game as well.
>
>Thoughts?
>
>>
>> Cheers,
>> -- jra
>
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